- Mailman-users - lists.mailman3.org

Upgrade docker-mailman to v0.5.2
by Christopher April 21, 2025

April 21, 2025

Hi Abhilash, I checkout the v0.5.2 for testing my upgrade from 0.4.6 and noticed, that the docker-image-version is still set to 0.4 in docker-compose.yaml. Is there any reason for it or should it be set to 0.5? I´m still using my good old mariadb. I did not find any upgrade-informations about breaking-changes. Do you have any experience with migrating from 0.4.6 to 0.5.2 on mariadb? Best regards Chrclaus

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posting bounced with 501 Message has defects
by Hitashi mancho April 21, 2025

April 21, 2025

Dear All, One of our users posted an email using a Bluemail Desktop client on one of the mailing lists. This email bounced with the reason "501 Message has defects". However, it gets accepted if the same user posts the same email on the same mailing list using Webmail (RoundCube) or Thunderbird. There is nothing in mailman.log and bounce.log, even in debug mode. Following is the SMTP log for the same email posting and the email header. Any guidance in debugging this will be highly appreciated. Regards, Hitachi. *SMTP.LOG:* Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) Available AUTH mechanisms: LOGIN(builtin) PLAIN(builtin) Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) Peer: ('127.0.0.1', 44502) Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) handling connection Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'220 lists.example.com GNU Mailman LMTP runner 2.0' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) _handle_client readline: b'LHLO lists\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) >> b'LHLO lists' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b' 250-lists.example.com' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'250-SIZE 33554432' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'250-8BITMIME' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'250 HELP' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) _handle_client readline: b'MAIL FROM:< user1(a)example.com> SIZE=3086\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) >> b'MAIL FROM:< user1(a)example.com> SIZE=3086' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) sender: user1(a)example.com Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'250 OK' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) _handle_client readline: b'RCPT TO:< prodlist-mm3(a)example.com>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) >> b'RCPT TO:< prodlist-mm3(a)example.com>' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) recip: prodlist-mm3(a)example.com Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'250 Ok' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) _handle_client readline: b'DATA\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) >> b'DATA' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'354 End data with <CR><LF>.<CR><LF>' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: from relay.example.com (relay.example.com [10.198.5.2])\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tby lists (Postfix) with QMQP id 9AFF48D\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tfor < prodlist-mm3(a)example.com>; Mon, 21 Apr 2025 18:00:47 +0530 (IST)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Delivered-To: CLUSTERHOST relay.example.com prodlist-mm3(a)example.com\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: (qmail 7951 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2025 18:00:47 +0530\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: from unknown (HELO smtp2.example.com) ([10.198.12.2])\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' (envelope-sender < user1(a)example.com>)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' by relay.example.com (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' for < prodlist-mm3(a)example.com>; 21 Apr 2025 18:00:47 +0530\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: (qmail 2533 invoked by uid 510); 21 Apr 2025 18:00:47 +0530\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Qmail-Scanner-Diagnostics: from 10.198.12.3 by smtp2 (envelope-from < user1(a)example.com>, uid 501) with qmail-scanner-2.11\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' spamassassin: 3.4.1. mhr: 1.0. {clamdscan: 0.100.0/26337} \r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' Clear:RC:1(10.198.12.3):SA:0(-6.0/7.0):. Processed in 3.727185 secs; 21 Apr 2025 18:00:47 +0530\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.1 (2015-04-28) on smtp2.example.com\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Spam-Level: \r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.0 required=7.0 tests=BAYES_20,HTML_MESSAGE,\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tIITB_ORIG,IITB_TARGET_ADDRESS,INTRA_IITB_MAIL,PROPER_IITB_MSGID\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tautolearn=disabled version=3.4.1\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Spam-Pyzor: Reported 0 times.\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Envelope-From: user1(a)example.com\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Qmail-Scanner-Mime-Attachments: |\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'X-Qmail-Scanner-Zip-Files: |\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: from unknown (HELO smtp3.example.com) (10.198.12.3)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' by smtp2.example.com with SMTP; 21 Apr 2025 18:00:43 +0530\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: from smtp-auth.example.com (smtpauth1.example.com [10.198.8.1])\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tby smtp3.example.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B70D4341971\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tfor < prodlist-mm3(a)example.com>; Mon, 21 Apr 2025 18:00:43 +0530 (IST)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Received: from localhost ( pruthvi.example.com [10.100.100.95])\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\t(using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits))\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\t(No client certificate requested)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\t(Authenticated sender: user1(a)example.com)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tby smtp-auth.example.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AB0CB30C340\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\tfor < prodlist-mm3(a)example.com>; Mon, 21 Apr 2025 18:00:43 +0530 (IST)\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Content-Type: multipart/alternative;\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' boundary="----sinikael-?=_1-17452386440190.1454723563624738"\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'From: user1 < user1(a)example.com>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Subject: test mail 14\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'To: prodlist-mm3(a)example.com \r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Message-Id: < 934811260a4bf.44bbdcec3e1d9(a)example.com>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2025 12:30:38 +0000\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'MIME-Version: 1.0\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'------sinikael-?=_1-17452386440190.1454723563624738\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Content-Type: text/plain\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'test mail 14 Get BlueMail for Desktop\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'------sinikael-?=_1-17452386440190.1454723563624738\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Content-Type: text/html; format=flowed\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'<html><head></head><body><div>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' <div dir="auto" id="compose-body-wrapper">test mail 14</div><div \r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'dir="auto" id="compose-body-wrapper"><br></div><div dir="auto" \r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'id="compose-body-wrapper"><br>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' <div dir="auto"><br></div>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' <div dir="auto" id="tmjah_g_1299">\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' Get BlueMail for Desktop\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' </div>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' <div dir="auto"><br></div>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' </div>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b' </div></body></html>\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'------sinikael-?=_1-17452386440190.1454723563624738--\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) DATA readline: b'.\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'501 Message has defects' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) _handle_client readline: b'QUIT\r\n' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) >> b'QUIT' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) << b'221 Bye' Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) connection lost Apr 21 18:00:47 2025 (1979121) ('127.0.0.1', 44502) Connection lost during _handle_client() *EMAIL HEADER:* Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----sinikael-?=_1-17452386441150.6962994414278503" From: user1 <user1(a)example.com> Subject: test mail 14 To: prodlist-mm3(a)example.com Message-Id: <934811260a4bf.44bbdcec3e1d9(a)example.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2025 12:30:38 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 ------sinikael-?=_1-17452386441150.6962994414278503 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit test mail 14 Get BlueMail for Desktop ------sinikael-?=_1-17452386441150.6962994414278503 Content-Type: text/html; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <html><head></head><body><div> <div dir="auto" id="compose-body-wrapper">test mail 14</div><div dir="auto" id="compose-body-wrapper"><br></div><div dir="auto" id="compose-body-wrapper"><br> <div dir="auto"><br></div> <div dir="auto" id="tmjah_g_1299"> Get BlueMail for Desktop </div> <div dir="auto"><br></div> </div> </div></body></html> ------sinikael-?=_1-17452386441150.6962994414278503--

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Setup Question: Disk-Layout (Migrating from Mailman 2.1)
by christian.schneider＠tu-dortmund.de April 21, 2025

April 21, 2025

Hello, actually I am running the latest available Mailman-2 Version on Ubuntu 20.04! Now it is really time to move on! :-) I want to set up a new server (Ubuntu-24.04) and install Mailman-3 with the Virtualenv setup method: https://docs.mailman3.org/en/latest/install/virtualenv.html As I know from my old Mailman-2.1 the archives could get quite big... ;-) So it seems very important to provide enough (expandable) disk space at the right place. (I plan to use a seperate partition with LVM for the path in question) But I could find no information about the location where hyperkitty stores the archives on an Ubuntu-/Linux-system. I assume the archives are stored underneath "/var/..." this is only a guess. But is this guess right? Another question is: How much space do I have to plan (roughly) for the "/opt"-partition for the mailman install if the archives are stored under "/var/..."? Any guidance ist very much appreciated! Thank you very much Chris

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moving from sqlite3 to postgresql
by Michael Richardson April 20, 2025

April 20, 2025

Hi, I installed mailman3 a few years ago on lists.sandelman.ca aka lists.tcpdump.org. My upgrade was in part a response to the HTTP based attacks that used the signup form on mailman2 to attack people via SMTP with DOS. I know the IETF mailman2 install {now gone} had some kind of delay implemented in the web form before you could submit. I didn't understand why. I installed via debian packages, and I'd really prefer to stay with that. (Not what many maintainers would say, I know. Essential that it work if mailman3 is going to take over) There were problems, probably with the hyperkitty integration with subsequent updates seemed to solve. I installed with sqlite3, since it seemed if all work was going to go through the mailman3 daemon, that it would handle all the concurrency issues. This has not been the case. I get weekly complaints about the database being locked. Sometimes this goes way on it's own, but sometimes it does not. A good way to tickle this is to go the web interface, go to a list with 200 held messages, and then having told it to show me 100+ messages per page, to then tell it to discard them all. So slow. Before I realized what was going on, I'd open multiple tabs to try to make this concurrent. So I tried to switch last week from sqlite3 to postgresql. I used pgloader with a configuration file attached below. This seemed easier than a sqlite3 dump/psql, as the SQL requires some massaging that seeemed to require more brainpower than I had at the time. I then edited /etc/mailman3/mailman.cfg to suit. I had set up the postgresql database under the "list" owner, so unix-domain socket permissions, and restarted. I then saw some errors: lists not found! I visited the web interface. NO LISTS. DAMN. I put it back. I haven't figured out what went wrong yet. I will clone the VM and try again. I will report whatever I find here. === load database from '/var/lib/mailman3/mailman.db' into postgresql:///mailman3 with include drop, create tables, create indexes, reset sequences set work_mem to '16MB', maintenance_work_mem to '512 MB'; === ps: I'd pay some $$ money for email support consulting.

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Disabling "delete account" option
by Hitashi mancho April 19, 2025

April 19, 2025

Dear all, Recently, I have migrated from Mailman2 to Mailman3 GNU Mailman 3.3.10 (Tom Sawyer) Python 3.11.9 Some of the list users logged into Postorius and went to profile settings. Over there, they found an option "Delete Account". Without any discussion, they deleted their account and all their list membership. How can we prevent this from happening? Is it possible to disable this "Delete Account" option, or can we add some admin approval? Regards, Hitachi. ___________________________________________ Mailman's content filtering has removed the following MIME parts from this message. Content-Type: image/png Name: firefox_lMnN5UcNTB.png Replaced multipart/alternative part with first alternative.

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Do you struggle with message rejected. AUP#CDRBL while using mailman with your ISP email relay?
by Michael Richardson April 18, 2025

April 18, 2025

I'm impressed by Philip Bondi's use of mailman[23] for home financial automation. ("Take off Eh!") ... It seems like a ticketing system would be a better system for such a use... maybe the IETF SML WG will further help with this.. (I find most Canadian financial institutions are so far behind the curve) I think that your email is hosted by hostedemail.com? I'm guessing that "eshop" is the mailbox you use for these common notices, and maybe you retrieve that into your mailman3 with fetchmail or something? Or does your ISP turn around and SMTP to you directly? Is it your MTA, their MTA, or mailman that is doing the rejection? My problem, on lists.sandelman.ca aka lists.tcpdump.org, is messages that appear to have been processed by my MTA (according to postfix logs), but which are never delivered, nor held. Lost somewhere in mailman3 queue. Sometimes they show up after a host reboot.

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Do you struggle with message rejected. AUP#CDRBL while using mailman with your ISP email relay?
by Philip Bondi April 17, 2025

April 17, 2025

Hello to all: mailman3 is phenomenal upgrade from mailman2. Very nice. Thank you to the team. In our family, we use mailman to provide redundancy on important financial emails. In this manner, emails from banks, government, ecommerce or other important providers are distributed to multiple family members. And we can ask family members if they paid the credit card bill, received their delivery, saw their tax liability or refund notification, etc. Does anyone else use mailman for such a purpose? Do you struggle with "message rejected. AUP#CDRBL" while using mailman with your ISP email relay? For example, when receiving email from a Bank or the Government of Canada on a mailman2 list, sometimes my ISP would not relay the email and I would get message rejected. AUP#CDRBL On mailman2, I mitigated by stripping headers, wrapping message and DKIM signing. Here is a mailman2 message that is stripped, wrapped and signed. https://freeimage.host/i/30O5EXe Do you have this problem with your ISP with certain senders? What are your mitigation strategies on mailman3?

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makemigrations --merge error after Debian upgrade
by Chupin Maxime April 16, 2025

April 16, 2025

Hi, I upgraded my debian version, and since, it seems that I have a problem. I tried `mailman-web migrate` (and `mailman-web collectstatic` etc.) and I get the error message: ``` CommandError: Conflicting migrations detected; multiple leaf nodes in the migration graph: (0010_auto_20220618_2315, 0014_schedule_cluster in django_q; 0014_auto_20220618_2315, 0018_alter_emailtemplate_language in postorius). To fix them run 'python manage.py makemigrations --merge' ``` So I tried `mailman-web makemigrations --merge` that ended with ``` PermissionError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/postorius/migrations/0019_merge_20240930_1159.py' ``` There is no such a file in the migration directory. Any idea ? Thanks in advance, All the best Maxime Chupin

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how should I implement multiple domains for receiving emails to a list
by Philip Bondi April 16, 2025

April 16, 2025

Hello to all: I think I have resolved almost all of my issues. Thank you for your coaching. You are all super heroes. I have two domains: systemdatabase.ca, systemdatabase.homelinux.com All my lists should be on both domains. So h(a)systemdatabase.ca is the same list as h(a)systemdatabase.homelinux.com. I found this was the mailman2 behaviour on my old CentOS 7 installation and I am accustomed to it. I edited /opt/mailman/venv_mm/var/data/postfix_lmtp directly. Duplicated and edited all the lines. And compiled with postmap /opt/mailman/venv_mm/var/data/postfix_lmtp I sent a test email. This appears to work. Is this the best method to achieve this goal? What would you recommend?

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Unable to ban users via mailman-shell
by Mihai Moldovan April 13, 2025

April 13, 2025

Hi I can't seem to be able to add bans via mailman-shell: # mailman-wrapper shell Welcome to the GNU Mailman shell >>> from mailman.testing.documentation import dump_json >>> from mailman.interfaces.mailinglist import IMailingList >>> from zope.component import getUtility >>> list_manager = getUtility(IListManager) >>> mlist = list_manager.get('x2go-commits(a)lists.x2go.org') >>> bans = IBanManager(mlist) >>> new_bans = ["really", "long", "list", "with", "addresses", "I'd", "like", "to", "ban"] >>> for new_ban in new_bans: ... bans.ban(new_ban) ... >>> for ban in bans: ... print('{0}: {1}'.format(ban.list_id,ban.email)) ... [long list of bans] >>> exit() # mailman-wrapper shell Welcome to the GNU Mailman shell >>> from mailman.testing.documentation import dump_json >>> from mailman.interfaces.mailinglist import IMailingList >>> from zope.component import getUtility >>> list_manager = getUtility(IListManager) >>> mlist = list_manager.get('x2go-commits(a)lists.x2go.org') >>> bans = IBanManager(mlist) >>> for ban in bans: ... print('{0}: {1}'.format(ban.list_id,ban.email)) ... >>> exit() GNU Mailman 3.3.8 (Tom Sawyer), installed on Ubuntu 24.04 via distro packages (yes, they are completely broken; yes, I had to backport fixes from your Gitlab instance to even get this properly installed and working; yes, I think I can handle this) What could possibly be the cause of this? I don't even see any calls to the REST API for each bans.ban() call. Should I see those? Or is bans.ban() directly modifying the database? I skimmed the source code and it looks like as if IBanManager and the concrete BanManager model seem to work directly on a DB connection, so I assume that it's not going through REST. If that is the case (I'm using sqlite3, nothing fancy), why doesn't it stick? Do I have to commit changes somehow? Mihai

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