Mailing list welcome message won't update
Hi there,
I have updated the welcome message for a mailing list by directly updating the file at: file:///var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/en/list:user:notice:welcome
I then restarted theses services: mailman3, mailman3-web and nginx.
But when I test subsribe to the mailing list, the welcome message does not update.
GNU Mailman 3.1.1 (Between The Wheels) Postorius Version 1.1.2
Thank you for your help in advance.
Frances
On 1/9/25 13:58, via Mailman-users wrote:
I have updated the welcome message for a mailing list by directly updating the file at: file:///var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/en/list:user:notice:welcome
I then restarted theses services: mailman3, mailman3-web and nginx.
But when I test subsribe to the mailing list, the welcome message does not update.
GNU Mailman 3.1.1 (Between The Wheels) Postorius Version 1.1.2
These are extremely old - over 7 years. This may have something to do with the issue.
There may be an issue in that the template table in the database is saying to look elsewhere.
What do you get for a database query like
SELECT uri FROM template WHERE name = 'list:user:notice:welcome' AND
context = '[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au';
where [redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au is the actual list-id.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Hi Mark,
Thank you for your prompt response and sorry for the delay in replying.
The below database query: mailmandb=> SELECT uri FROM template WHERE name = 'list:user:notice:welcome' AND context = '[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au';
produced output:
uri
file:///var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/en/list:user:notice:welcome (1 row)
Looks to be exactly the same as in the settings for that particular mailing list.
Frances
On 1/14/25 15:00, via Mailman-users wrote:
The below database query: mailmandb=> SELECT uri FROM template WHERE name = 'list:user:notice:welcome' AND context = '[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au';
produced output:
uri
file:///var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/en/list:user:notice:welcome (1 row)
Looks to be exactly the same as in the settings for that particular mailing list.
Does the actual file have a .txt extension. It needs that even though the uri in the template table doesn't have that.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Good point....
I can see 5 files in the directory:
list:member:generic:footer.txt
list:member:regular:footer
list:user:notice:welcome
list:user:notice:welcome.bk
list:user:notice:welcome.txt
"list:user:notice:welcome.bk" has the wrong welcome message. (I renamed it to back it up before correcting the welcome message) "list:user:notice:welcome" and "list:user:notice:welcome.txt" has the identical correct welcome message.
I removed "list:user:notice:welcome.bk".
Now I have:
-rwxr--r-- 1 list list 0 Oct 10 2018 list:member:generic:footer.txt* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 0 Mar 30 2021 list:member:regular:footer* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 507 Jan 9 01:35 list:user:notice:welcome* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 506 Jan 15 04:45 list:user:notice:welcome.txt*
I restarted mailman3.service, mailman3-web and nginx.service.
Tested and issue still persisted....
Thank you for your help!
Frances
via Mailman-users writes:
Now I have:
-rwxr--r-- 1 list list 0 Oct 10 2018 list:member:generic:footer.txt* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 0 Mar 30 2021 list:member:regular:footer* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 507 Jan 9 01:35 list:user:notice:welcome* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 506 Jan 15 04:45 list:user:notice:welcome.txt*
LGTM, not sure why the issue persists.
Have you checked that group and world have 'x' (directory search) permissions on every directory in the path to these files? (This is unlikely to be the problem but it's easy to check.)
And it shouldn't matter but those files themselves don't need 'x' (execute) permission.
Pretty sure the existence of the .bk file has nothing to do with this problem. Evidently you don't need it this time, but in the future you needn't hesitate to keep backups around if they would be useful.
Steve
On 1/14/25 20:51, via Mailman-users wrote:
"list:user:notice:welcome.bk" has the wrong welcome message. (I renamed it to back it up before correcting the welcome message) "list:user:notice:welcome" and "list:user:notice:welcome.txt" has the identical correct welcome message.
I removed "list:user:notice:welcome.bk".
Now I have:
-rwxr--r-- 1 list list 0 Oct 10 2018 list:member:generic:footer.txt* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 0 Mar 30 2021 list:member:regular:footer* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 507 Jan 9 01:35 list:user:notice:welcome* -rwxr--r-- 1 list list 506 Jan 15 04:45 list:user:notice:welcome.txt*
I restarted mailman3.service, mailman3-web and nginx.service.
Tested and issue still persisted....
If list:user:notice:welcome and list:user:notice:welcome.txt have the identical content, why aren't they the same size?
In any case, you can remove both list:user:notice:welcome and list:member:regular:footer as the won't be used in any case.
As Steve suggests check that the list user:group has search and read
access to all the superordinate directories.
Is there anything relevant in mailman.log?
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Thanks Stephen and Mark.
I checked whether group and world have 'x' permission on every directory in the path to the files and found below:
root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates# ll total 12 drwxr-xr-x 3 list list 4096 Oct 10 2018 ./ drwxr-xr-x 12 list list 4096 Jan 9 05:08 ../ drwxr--r-- 5 list list 4096 Mar 30 2021 lists/
root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates# cd lists/ root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists# ll total 20 drwxr--r-- 5 list list 4096 Mar 30 2021 ./ drwxr-xr-x 3 list list 4096 Oct 10 2018 ../ drwxr--r-- 3 list list 4096 Jan 8 01:14 [redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/
root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists# cd p[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/ root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au# ll total 12 drwxr--r-- 3 list list 4096 Jan 8 01:14 ./ drwxr--r-- 5 list list 4096 Mar 30 2021 ../ drwxr--r-- 2 list list 4096 Jan 15 04:45 en/
So, group and world did not have 'x' permission to all the superordinate directories.
I didn't see anything relevant in mailman.log.
I am not sure why the "list:user:notice:welcome" and "list:user:notice:welcome.txt" has different sizes even though they contain the identical welcome message.
I decided to delete these two files: list:member:regular:footer list:user:notice:welcome
Restarted services and tested again. -> issue still persisted.
Should I try giving group and world the 'x' permission for all superordinate directories? Although my other mailing list has the same setup (no 'x' permission for group and world and it seems to be working fine.)
Thanks for your help.
Frances
On 1/15/25 14:29, via Mailman-users wrote:
Thanks Stephen and Mark.
I checked whether group and world have 'x' permission on every directory in the path to the files and found below:
root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates# ll total 12 drwxr-xr-x 3 list list 4096 Oct 10 2018 ./ drwxr-xr-x 12 list list 4096 Jan 9 05:08 ../ drwxr--r-- 5 list list 4096 Mar 30 2021 lists/
root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates# cd lists/ root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists# ll total 20 drwxr--r-- 5 list list 4096 Mar 30 2021 ./ drwxr-xr-x 3 list list 4096 Oct 10 2018 ../ drwxr--r-- 3 list list 4096 Jan 8 01:14 [redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/
root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists# cd p[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au/ root@lists:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].lists.[redacted].org.au# ll total 12 drwxr--r-- 3 list list 4096 Jan 8 01:14 ./ drwxr--r-- 5 list list 4096 Mar 30 2021 ../ drwxr--r-- 2 list list 4096 Jan 15 04:45 en/
So, group and world did not have 'x' permission to all the superordinate directories.
I don't think that matters. As long as everything is running as user
list. How are you testing. Are you running a mailman command and if
so, are you running that as user list.
Note that mailman commands should only ever be run as the Mailman
user, list in your case.
If that explains the issue, fine. Otherwise this seems to be an issue with the Debian package and should be reported to Debian. See https://wiki.list.org/x/12812344
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
HI Mark,
I simply tested by unsubsribing to the mailing list and then re-subscribing to receive the welcome message.
How do you test using the mailman command with user list?
Thank you.
Frances
On 1/16/25 13:43, via Mailman-users wrote:
HI Mark,
I simply tested by unsubsribing to the mailing list and then re-subscribing to receive the welcome message.
How do you test using the mailman command with user list?
sudo -u list mailman addmembers -h
or in your case, you may not have that subcommand in which case see
sudo -u list mailman members -h
However, that is all irrelevant. I only thought you might be testing by
using mailman commands to add a member and if so and if the command is
not run as user list, it might not have access to read the template.
If you are (un)subscribing via Postorius or via email these are handled
by Mailman runner processes which should all be running as user list
and should have access to the template.
So, as I said, I don't know what the issue is unless it is something with your Debian package which is ancient. Even Debian buster has mailman core 3.2.1.
Does your empty list:member:generic:footer.txt work to not add any footer to list messages? If so, I can't think of any reason why your list:user:notice:welcome.txt wouldn't be used.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
"Does your empty list:member:generic:footer.txt work to not add any footer to list messages? If so, I can't think of any reason why your list:user:notice:welcome.txt wouldn't be used."
Sorry, I am not sure how to chekc this. Can I use a mailman command? Where does that footer get added if it was not empty?
Thanks.
Frances
On 1/16/25 15:14, via Mailman-users wrote:
"Does your empty list:member:generic:footer.txt work to not add any footer to list messages? If so, I can't think of any reason why your list:user:notice:welcome.txt wouldn't be used."
Sorry, I am not sure how to chekc this. Can I use a mailman command? Where does that footer get added if it was not empty?
Thanks.
Frances
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This message sent to mark@msapiro.net
In the above message received from the list, the footer (which is custom) is everything from the horizontal line below your name to the end of the message (and will be added again below my sig).
A default footer for this list would be just
_______________________________________________
Mailman-users mailing list -- mailman-users@mailman3.org
To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-leave@mailman3.org
If the message is a single text/plain part, the footer is added to the body inline. If it is a MIME multipart message, the footer is attached as a separate MIME part.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Hi Mark,
I have a dev mailman server that is having the same problem too. (When updated the welcome text file, then subscribe to the mailing list but still get the old welcome message.)
The dev mailman instance is much newer:
GNU Mailman 3.3.9 (Tom Sawyer) Postorius Version 1.3.13
I also found that the actual file containing the welcome message and footer message does not have the .txt extension for my dev instance.
root@mailman-dev:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].mailman-dev.dev.aws.[redacted].org.au/en# ll total 12 drwxr--r-- 2 mailman operations 4096 Jan 22 14:14 ./ drwxr--r-- 3 mailman operations 4096 Oct 1 13:50 ../ -rwxr--r-- 1 mailman operations 0 Oct 1 13:50 list:member:regular:footer* -rwxr--r-- 1 mailman operations 506 Jan 22 14:12 list:user:notice:welcome*
What is that * at the end of the file name mean?
Thank you.
Frances
On 1/21/25 20:26, via Mailman-users wrote:
I also found that the actual file containing the welcome message and footer message does not have the .txt extension for my dev instance.
The files will not be used unless they have the .txt extension. You need to rename them to add the .txt extension.
root@mailman-dev:/var/lib/mailman3/templates/lists/[redacted].mailman-dev.dev.aws.[redacted].org.au/en# ll total 12 drwxr--r-- 2 mailman operations 4096 Jan 22 14:14 ./ drwxr--r-- 3 mailman operations 4096 Oct 1 13:50 ../ -rwxr--r-- 1 mailman operations 0 Oct 1 13:50 list:member:regular:footer* -rwxr--r-- 1 mailman operations 506 Jan 22 14:12 list:user:notice:welcome*
What is that * at the end of the file name mean?
It means the file is executable. It shouldn't be so you can change the mode from rwxr--r-- to rw-r--r--
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
participants (3)
-
frances.du＠uq.edu.au -
Mark Sapiro -
Stephen J. Turnbull